Red Breasted Goose - Scaling Dam

[James Robson]

Here are a few video clips of the bird taken from the hide at Scaling Dam when you were there Damian and then Harry M:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jr_studio/6221070372/

http://www.flickr.com/photos/jr_studio/6221157212/

[M Fishpool]

I dont think there are collections at either Rushpool or Saltburn Bank now - I havent seen the Egyptian Geese at Saltburn recently, or anything else, and the collection at Rushpool seems to be restricted to some domesticated white geese, peacocks and mallards.  Not sure what has happened with the collection at Priory Pond in Guisborough - I saw a Pink foot on Skelton Beck at Apple Orchard last year that I attributed to this collection.

[AKinghorn]

Something that did concern me about this bird is the fact its tail looked a bit worn to me?

[JohnM]

A few more shots of the Goose, as it came closer to the hide today (10th).
Is the last shot an indication of what the Goose thinks about all the speculation on it's origin?

JohnM

[Col D]

Here is something to consider!

I have just checked out the geese on the North Tees Marshes and there is a juvenile Brent Goose with the feral Canada Geese on Saltholme West! Do I count this or relegate it to the 'plastic' bin and not bother sending in a record slip; after all it is associating with Canada Geese rather than a nearby flock of Barnacle Geese and Pink-feet on Back Saltholme. Incidentally, this is the Barnacle Goose flock that has hovered around the 40-50 mark since their suspiciously early arrival date but has now increased to 63, how do we decide which of these are genuine. This is an area where I have seen Cape Shelduck, Speckled Teal, Chestnut Teal, Bar-headed Goose, Black Swan, White-headed Duck, Ruddy Shelduck, Lesser Scaup, Ring-necked Duck, American Wigeon, Lesser White-fronted Goose, Snow Goose, Ross's Goose, Egyptian Goose, Ringed Teal and Hooded Merganser. Some of these have been deemed acceptable and some not. The origin of wildfowl seems a harder nut to crack than the origin of species!    

Col

[Ian Foster]

Something that did concern me about this bird is the fact its tail looked a bit worn to me?

looking at Martyn Sidwells flight shot and John M's "bottom" photo the tail looks fine to me! Anyone disagree?

Having seen the bird myself (just happened to be passing of course   ) i'm finding it hard to make my mind up about this bird. Rare Wildfoul are of course one of the trickiest species groups to judge upon but i prefer to go along with Inoccent until proved guilty. I believe White-headed Duck and Ross's Goose should be on the British and County list. Not so sure about the Lesser White-front though...and yes i did go and see it!

A few thoughts going through my mind though are firstly if this bird had not re-located to Scailing Dam would we be having this discussion at all? I know some local birders did go looking at Saltburn so maybe we would?

Using whats held in captivity as a tool for judging if a bird is acceptable or not is a none starter, almost everything is held in captivity, especially so with Wildfoul!

I'd guess a lot of Cleveland listers are calling in to see this bird for "insurance" purposes only and not because they believe it's wild!

Like Jamie has already stated the 94' Bufflehead was accepted by BBRC but with the comment "The publication of these records (refering to the Nottingham and Cleveland Bufflehead records) does not constitute any official endorsement of their status as wild birds, but merely that in both cases their identification was established beyond doubt". Could the same happen again with Red-breasted Goose?

It's interesting to note that the October 1978 Spurn bird (an Adult) re-located the same day to Covenham Reservoir in Lincolnshire and later to Kent (all records accepted by BBRC as the same).

Sorry for waffling on...

Ian.

[Damian]

Just wondered what the reason(s) were for not accepting the previous record of Red-breasted Goose ?

[RCT]

Hi Damian
It was initially accepted by BBRC but this was later reversed at the request of TBCRSC (The request had to be made twice!) and the single observer from outside the area considered it a prob escape. The questioning of the decision was based on the fact that what was obviously the same bird relocating to Nosterfield was deemed unacceptable by BBRC, a strange case of double standards. Seemingly a coastal bird was rated better than an inland one.
Cheers
Richard

[Damian]

Hi Richard,
Many thanks for the info, I was just curious as I hadn't heard much about this particular record.

Regards
Damian

[AKinghorn]

Noticed BirdGuides and RBA have given it the kiss of death with the "presumed escapee" tag, does anyone know if they know something we don't?

[D.C]

Another point is that these birds cost well over a hundred quid. Surely if you went through all the work of hatching and rearing, you would take the simple steps to pinion or keep the bird cut down; not simply let it fly away.
If it is captive bred, the owner is either daft or has too much money..
Birdguides is doing what most do with wildfowl, having a good guess..

[AKinghorn]

The story so far:
- Bird turned up on its own on a beach at Saltburn, since then singles of a few species have been turning up in the area (Brent, Pink-foot).
- The bird then flew inland and joined the local Canadas/Greylags at Scaling Dam

Then all of a sudden its put out as an "a presumed escape", "escape", however you want to put it. Do they know something those who have seen the bird don't?

From what I understand and have been told no Red-breasted Geese successfully fledged young this year in the UK, eliminating the possibility of the bird being from fence-hopping parents.

So from my understanding this bird is either;
1) The Real Deal!
2) An escaped bird from this year.

Still sitting on the fence, but gradually leaning to one of the above.

[James Robson]

Here is a blog entry to add to the debate from Yorkshire:

http://yorkshirebirdingmagazine.blogspot.com/2011/10/wild-goose-chase.html

cheers
James